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How Obama Tried to Kill the Brazil-France Military Deal PDF Print E-mail
Written by José Wilson Miranda   
Thursday, 17 September 2009

France's Rafale Les Echos, a French daily, has shown a little of what they say happened backstage during the negotiations between Brazil and France to buy the French military jet Rafale. Trying to upstage his French colleague, American president Barack Obama called Brazilian president Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva twice, says the Paris newspaper.

Les Echos revealed up-to-now unknown information on the Obama administration's efforts to make sure the Brazilian government would choose the F-18 manufactured by Boeing, instead of the French fighter. The planes are for the renewal of FAB's (Brazil's Air Force) fleet

As reported by the publication, "Until the beginning of 2009, the competition was only a French-Swedish duel. Starting in mid-July, however, there was a change of atmosphere: Boeing and the Obama administration deployed the steamroller.

"From his vacation spot, the American president calls Lula to tell him that the United States will go the extra mile in terms of technological transfer and Congress will guarantee it."

According to Les Echos, the US started an "influence battle" and sent the following message to a French negotiator: "We didn't think that this thing would go so far in disinformation."

The newspaper tells that Obama only decided to personally take part in the negotiations after finding out how remote were the chances of the F-18 winning the bid against the Rafale.

The first Obama call happened during his vacation in Martha's Vineyard, between August 23 and 30. According to the newspaper, Obama called Lula and offered himself as guarantor that the technology transfer of the F-18 would be approved by the American Congress. He then promised to call again when he got the confirmation of the Congress approval.

Despite Obama's assurances, the French paper says that Lula called Sarkozy, August 31st, to tell the French president that he had chosen the Rafale. When he arrived in Brazilian capital Brasília, September 6, on the eve of the Brazilian Independence Day, Sarkozy tried to get a public statement that Brazil had opted for the French solution.

On September 7 all the signs indicated that Brazil had made its mind, but it seems that the Obama charm was already starting to work.

Since then the French seem to be in overdrive to secure the agreement. Les Echos tells that Nicolas Sarkozy was awoken at 3 am to agree to the terms that were concocted by the Brazilian Defense minister and the Air Force chief on one side and Sarkozy's chief of staff and Dassault-Aviation boss on the other.

On September 16, Defense minister Nelson Jobim, who had complained in the past about the Rafale's high cost, confirmed his preference for the French war plane mainly because of the promised technological transfer. More than once Jobim doubted the good faith of the Americans. "I'm a lawyer," he said, "and I work with jurisprudence. The precedents I have from the United States are bad."

Brazilian newspaper O Estado de S. Paulo tried to check the information published by Les Echos and got some contradictory answers.

While a Brazilian source involved with the negotiations commented: "Whoever wrote the story seems to be an insider," an aide to Lula dismissed the whole affair: "There's absolutely nothing to it. I find very unlikely, almost impossible that there has been a call from Obama."

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Surprised that Obama would want a US company making military aircraft to suceed
written by grumpygresh, September 17, 2009
I think it's shocking to see that Obama would actually want a US military aircraft maker to succeed. This is completely antithetical to Obama's anti American, anti military, anti imperialist ideology. Obama has revealed himself to be an enemy of capitalism especially American capitalism. Perhaps he was just doing this for show. His quadrupling of the US debt and deficit is a conscious effort to destroy the dollar. His penchant for government control and high taxes satisfies his sadistic desire to punish successful people and those that aspire to become successful.
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written by João da Silva, September 17, 2009
Where is Dr.Lloyd Cata when we need him ?
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written by realismist, September 17, 2009
Time for the tinfoil hat grumpygresh.
Just like your divine hero, Gorge, Obama has inherited a country in need of drastic actions, many of which will make him extremely unpopular with those looking for reasons to be so (other than their own in-breed hate)

Now to the topic on hand...
Brasil is a huge potetial market, there is no reason Obama would not take the time to get the US's foot in the door.
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written by João da Silva, September 17, 2009
Now to the topic on hand...
Brasil is a huge potetial market


I agree with you that Brasil is a huge potential market , though with one qualifying statement. It is a Huge potential market for the Chinese, but not for Obama. Sarko is far ahead of PBO in the "seduction game" and so is Jingtao. smilies/wink.gif
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written by Lloyd Cata, September 18, 2009
I have been following this debate and all of the excellent reasons for and against the competitors in this international arms sale drama. It has all the qualities of an excellent novela.

João
CHEATERS, LIARS & UNRELIABLE.
EPSILON ERIDANI
No question the US F-x fighter is the dominant military product on the market. Both in offensive and defensive aspects. The Swiss entry has all the fundamental aspects of NATO qualifications for the European theater. The French proposal is simply a superior offer on many fronts.
ch.c
CHEATERS, LIARS & UNRELIABLE !!!!!!
Brazil always WANTS to get something...but never ever provide the reciprocity.
Quite the same at the WTO level...for example.
BRAZILIANS HAVE ONLY A ONE WAY MIND...NOTHING ELSE !
AUGUSTUS SEVERUS, September 09, 2009
I trully hope to see BOTH of my countries working together in a firm partnership
I hope it works out!!! For me, at least it would represent an ideal situation...

BTW, at this moment I can't recall who, but thank you for the excellent qualifications for the Swedish plane. All the technical qualifications presented have been impressive.

I shall try to be consistent in my remarks on this plane deal. Brazil sits at the crossroads of another East-West competition for global competition in economic and military superiority. Latin America is the last best challenge for the market in arms. The US government is all too aware that they are behind in this challenge. Yes, the US taxpayers would indeed pay dearly to get this deal. Financed over the period of the contract. No wonder Lula thinks he can get them for nothing. Considering the coming crash of the dollar, it would be an easy call. Except for one thing;
In 2005, Washington prevented Brasilia from selling 24 of its Super Tucano turboprop patrol planes to Venezuela because they contained US-made components, increasing Brazil's wariness of US controls on the export of sensitive military technology and software.

The French offer is compelling for several reasons, namely the technology transfer which could lead to Brazil having a viable space program. (Something I thought they might do to sweeten the deal!). The French plane has all the qualifications for NATO standoff readiness, so in a defensive posture (being the reason for the purchase) it should perform adequately, given the diplomatic climate in which they may be called to action. I was momentarily surprised at the swiftness and consideration of the Brazilian Air Force with regard to the French offer. It was timely and served notice that those with military experience who will fly the planes is being considered. What surprised me was the lack of enthusiasm for the French plane considering the last fleet of French origin and the relationship between BrazilianAirForce and their French counterparts. This is a hint that the BAF is not too pleased with the French performance. Ergo, the outcry of "LIARS".

Given my past and present respect for Brazil as a member of the non-aligned movement and given Swedish leadership in this arena, I am convinced that it is the correct choice for this contract. It presents the opportunity for Brazil to gain technology, become self-sufficient in modern aircraft manufacturing, and does not contain the strings of geopolitical and foreign strategic interests. As previously stated it has impressive qualifications and is immune to East-West coercion. Venezuela would do well to remember the recent Russian experience of Cuba with respect to East-West relations. It may not appreciate the trade-off of Russian entry into WTO upsetting Mr. Chavez ambitions. For the life (30) years of the relationship of this deal it is both for Brazilian independence and the future of Latin America that I support the Swedish proposal. The French have an impressive naval presence in the Brazilian military complex and, of course, the Americans already have enormous, if not decisive, commercial influence. Balance and flexibility further support the Swedish proposal.
It is probably not the most politically correct decision, or the best military option, but this decision will certainly clarify whether the Brazilian government will be swayed by who will line their pockets. In that instance, neither the French or the Swedish offers can compete with the US offer. The calls from Washington will not only target Lula and the Brazilian military but will certainly target key legislators in the Brazilian Senate. Be prepared for more twists in this novela. Again I must say, "the US-Brazilian relationship will certainly contain dancing and loud music."
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Buy American
written by jay glenn, September 18, 2009
Buy American, if you use it against us we can just turn off the GPS controls for the Jets Tanks ect.....

Works for me.

Ask any one who uses GPS what happens when the USA goes to war.

It's accuracy is down graded, but only in regions out of the USA FIeld of intrest.

Just keep in mind the French made that air speed inicator on the Air france flight.

Don't mind Lead in your paint, childs toys or Babby food, Go to China.

Lead Can't do much more Brain damanage in Brazil
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Jay Glenn
written by João da Silva, September 18, 2009
Buy American


There is nothing American to buy anymore. Even your flags are made in PRC!

Ask any one who uses GPS what happens when the USA goes to war.


We cant ask the dead ones. The living ones are Lost and well hidden in the mountains of Afghanistan.

There is no point in exhorting us to buy "American". We are taking the suggestions of Mr.Severus, Mr.Amaral, Mr.Sage, Comrade ch.c and last but not the least Dr.Cata and going in for the Gripen. Even the HP computers made in Brasil are assembled in this country "Made of imported components from PRC". The funnier thing is that they sell their PCs for exorbitant prices with Windows Vista Basic( which is a bloody joke).

May be if Google decides to make fighter planes, I might rethink about buying "American"!!!!!!

The French are quite slimy, though I can not deny that they make very good kitchen appliances and their technological know-how in this manufacturing sector is superb. Of course, ch.c will contest this statement of mine.
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To all !!!!!
written by ch.c., September 18, 2009
to make it short....just refer to my comments posted in the other thread in the article "Brazil is no Venezuela"

And to Joao on the French kitchens appliances, my answer is.....

YOU SIMPLY DONT KNOW WHAT GERMANS, SWISS quality are in these kitchen appliances !
Because you simply cant afford ! Nothing wrong, it is just the reality !
Thus you simply dont know what you are talking about !
More simple there is NOT !

Better yet...just to show you how ignorant (smiles) you are with your apparent love with French Kitchen Appliances QUALITY.
I am sure you refer to Moulinex as you already did months ago. Right ?
Bad luck for you jOAO but but but....most Moulinex appliances are MADE IN CHINA AND NOT IN FRANCE !
You may as well check that by yourself next time you have a look at these appliances !!!!!!

and...and...the products still made in France are not a better quality than those made in China.

Joao....I dont criticize you to like or love french kitchen appliances but you are simply dead dead dead wrong about their QUALITY......which is different !

Finally.... kitchen appliances, such as fridges, freezers, dishwashers, weashing machines, cooktops, wall ovens etc etc MADE IN KOREA, AND FROM KOREAN FIRMS are far far more better quality than the french corresponding brands !
Even Italians easily beat French for kitchen appliances quality and design !!!!

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Outside of the above......
written by ch.c., September 18, 2009
I cant stop laughing at Sarko so proud of being a " close friend" of Obama and America !
Sarko is shooting in his own rear as usual !
And America will betray and cheat every trade partner as it pleases them, and whenever they decide !
From France, to UK, to Brazil, to China, to Switzerland (sniff sniff), Italy or.....just name it !

North or South Americans are both UNRELIABLE secular trade partners !

And none are going to win in a secular way ! Both are mostly and most of the time too short term oriented !
No visions for their own children futures who will have to bear the cost of their parents legacy!
And their children when grown do nothing better for their own children !
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ch.c
written by João da Silva, September 18, 2009
While welcoming you back warmly, I must make some counter comments:

YOU SIMPLY DONT KNOW WHAT GERMANS, SWISS quality are in these kitchen appliances !
Because you simply cant afford ! Nothing wrong, it is just the reality !
Thus you simply dont know what you are talking about !


How the heck are you so sure that I don't about the German, Swiss ,quality? For that matter how sure are you that our FAB officers do not know about the quality of the fighter planes?

Bad luck for you jOAO but but but....most Moulinex appliances are MADE IN CHINA AND NOT IN FRANCE !
You may as well check that by yourself next time you have a look at these appliances !!!!!!


I am talking about Moulinex and the ones I bought were not made in PRC, but in France and they are very good and still work. BUT....BUT.. the problem these days is the famous brand name products are all made in PRC. Some months ago, you mentioned about Vietnam and to your credit you are very right. IMHO, the Vietnamese pay more attention to quality, though in Brasil, it is hard to find products made in that country.

Finally.... kitchen appliances, such as fridges, freezers, dishwashers, weashing machines, cooktops, wall ovens etc etc MADE IN KOREA, AND FROM KOREAN FIRMS are far far more better quality than the french corresponding brands !


No doubt about it. I like LG brands which are fortunately made in Brazil and of very high quality. Their after sales service is superb too.

Even Italians easily beat French for kitchen appliances quality and design !!!!


I do not know about Italian kitchen appliances, but their cutlery are very good.

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written by Lloyd Cata, September 19, 2009
Outside of the above......ch.c
Both are mostly and most of the time too short term oriented !
No visions for their own children futures who will have to bear the cost of their parents legacy!


Afraid you may be correct here...But...But...I am hopeful Brazil will do the correct thing which they have done before concerning the energy crisis of the 1970's. Too little recognition of Brazil's foresight in addressing the dangers of energy dependence are appreciated. More than any other decision in modern Brazilian history, the Brazilian investment in bio-fuels for the transportation sector has paid enormous dividends in stabilizing the Brazilian economy. There are several key decisions Brazil will make in the next year, before the elections, that will carry through for another 20-30 years. That is why it is so important that corruption be investigated and punished before it destroys the ability for correct and independent decisions.
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Shameless Advertiser - Guilty
written by Lloyd Cata, September 19, 2009
João,

On the subject of appliances I cannot help put out a word for MONDRAGON (http://www.mcc.es/). I believe they have a manufacturing facility in Brazil. I only endorse this company and its products because it highlights the essence of my 'prime directive' in contributing to the discussion, and that is to spread the truth.

Mondragon exemplifies the meaning of a successful workers cooperative. This type of union of workers united to produce, with care and quality, without capitalist corporate management. As the seventh largest industry in Spain, with international affiliates, it puts truth to the lie that workers united cannot succeed without capitalist structures to support and maintain their independent companies. Companies that are FREE to put workers concerns above the corporate capitalist agenda.
This is happening at a greater rate throughout the global economy as I see the workers in Argentina also have united to own and operate companies there. To a small extent, even in the US, workers are proving that they can compete successfully with the bloated corporate giants.

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Llyod Cata
written by João da Silva, September 19, 2009
There are several key decisions Brazil will make in the next year, before the elections, that will carry through for another 20-30 years. That is why it is so important that corruption be investigated and punished before it destroys the ability for correct and independent decisions.


For months I have been stressing these two points and I am glad that you agree with me. As for the bio-fuels, the lead was taken by our Late President Geisel immediately after the first "Oil Shock" and his successor Late President Figueiredo continued with the project. Those two were men of great vision.

On the subject of appliances I cannot help put out a word for MONDRAGON (http://www.mcc.es/). I believe they have a manufacturing facility in Brazil.


I went through their site and they do have several manufacturing units (and service sector industries) in the state of São Paulo. Their appliances are not sold under their band name, which is not well known among the Brasilian consumers- at least in the South where we live. It is quite interesting to read about what you have written about them. There have been "incidents" in Brasil, where the workers were given command over companies by judicial order. But to my knowledge, many of them went bankrupt. I remember a famous and traditional manufacturers of Crystal Glasses that took this path. Right now, the game is to create large private corporate giants through acquisitions, mergers, "induced" bankruptcy, etc; with the full blessings of the government. Of course, the government knows what is good for the people and so I am not complaining.
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